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Index » Regional/Local » Europe » Ukraine Page: Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 68, 69, 70 ... 89, 90, 91  Next
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NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 8:27am

 Lazy8 wrote:
 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:
Well, yes, but they are kind of useful, for you can rest assured that the arguments they tout are meant to divert away from the stuff that really upsets their paymasters.  This whole fear of NATO thing and protecting the geographical borders is actually bullshit. The invading hordes are not on horseback anymore. They come via the internet and with rules-based agreements in their hands.  It's also obvious that geopolitical manoeuvring is not Putin's main reason for the war, as he just opened his entire back door to the Chinese, who will be rubbing their hands in glee. No, Robert Reich is right at least on this one. What Putin is actually afraid of is the spread of liberal democracy. Look at how repressive the reaction was in Belarus. Now Ukraine. Putin knows his days are numbered and he feels like a cornered rat - and he's acting like one.

Wait, Robert Reich is right about something? Who knew? OK, his observations are pretty blindingly obvious....when they don't revert to his usual partisan hackery (his response to rising oil prices: tax oil companies. Yeah, that'll fix it! Wasn't he supposed to be an economist at some point?) but I guess it's useful for those in his bubble. There may yet be some positive consequences from this. Europe may finally take responsibility for its own defense. It may serve as a wake-up call for voters in Poland and Hungary, who have been electing nationalist autocrats recently. If we have the patience and commitment to bear the consequences of isolating Russia after this it may undermine Putin in Russia to the point his crumbling economy finally turns people against him. Don't hold your breath on that last point (Fidel Castro died of old age) but somewhere there is a lamppost with Putin's name on it. I hope it finds him soon.
 
let's stick to the tragedy unfolding here. There is a distinct feeling of unease that this is not going to stop with Ukraine and that the sanctions imposed so far are going to have the opposite effect to that intended, namely that he'll just laugh at the mamby-pamby soft westerners with their decadent lifestyles as he shows them what a real strong man can do. The man is unhinged. Living in an information bubble fed by the frightened sycophants around him, emboldened by the lack of any real resistance. None of this is good. And yes, haven't we been here before?
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 8:02am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

just got a call out on our local kids group looking for billets for the first bus load of kids from Ukraine.

Putin huilo. I mean srsly. 



i don't know much about this organization however i see people i'm very familiar with donating... (i'm sure they are going to be overwhelmed)

Together against trauma of war

Charitable Foundation Voices of Children helps children affected by the war in eastern Ukraine. Thanks to you, we provide psychological and psychosocial support to children. It helps them overcome the consequences of armed conflict and develop.


Lazy8

Lazy8 Avatar

Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 7:53am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:
Well, yes, but they are kind of useful, for you can rest assured that the arguments they tout are meant to divert away from the stuff that really upsets their paymasters. 

This whole fear of NATO thing and protecting the geographical borders is actually bullshit. The invading hordes are not on horseback anymore. They come via the internet and with rules-based agreements in their hands.  It's also obvious that geopolitical manoeuvring is not Putin's main reason for the war, as he just opened his entire back door to the Chinese, who will be rubbing their hands in glee.

No, Robert Reich is right at least on this one. What Putin is actually afraid of is the spread of liberal democracy. Look at how repressive the reaction was in Belarus. Now Ukraine. Putin knows his days are numbered and he feels like a cornered rat - and he's acting like one.

Wait, Robert Reich is right about something? Who knew?

OK, his observations are pretty blindingly obvious....when they don't revert to his usual partisan hackery (his response to rising oil prices: tax oil companies. Yeah, that'll fix it! Wasn't he supposed to be an economist at some point?) but I guess it's useful for those in his bubble.

There may yet be some positive consequences from this. Europe may finally take responsibility for its own defense. It may serve as a wake-up call for voters in Poland and Hungary, who have been electing nationalist autocrats recently. If we have the patience and commitment to bear the consequences of isolating Russia after this it may undermine Putin in Russia to the point his crumbling economy finally turns people against him.

Don't hold your breath on that last point (Fidel Castro died of old age) but somewhere there is a lamppost with Putin's name on it. I hope it finds him soon.
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 7:53am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

just got a call out on our local kids group looking for billets for the first bus load of kids from Ukraine.

Putin huilo. I mean srsly. 




NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 7:52am

 black321 wrote:

Sure, that seems to be the narrative...backwards thinking ideology - MEAGA!
But the west is unwilling to do the one thing that might actually hurt Russia: stop buying their oil.
Because why? Can't get our other "allies" like Saudi Arabia to pump more? Maybe work out a deal with Venezuela? Pump more domestic, or still need to push through the progressive narrative of fossil fuels are evil? 
Seems weak we can't make that type of sacrifice.
 
Agree completely. 
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 7:15am

 miamizsun wrote:


coffee thoughts

in the US we have misused liberal and conservative labels out of convenience

there are generally liberal and conservative people, but we shouldn't conflate them with dogmatic radicals on the far right and far left

those radicals (far left and far right) certainly aren't liberal or conservative, they're two sides of the same authoritarian coin

liberal values, which are essentially basic human rights, are at a stark difference with extremists endorsing violence

the challenge with some of the poor reasoning and logic of the post modern believers is there isn't an objective truth

especially when attempting to justify bad behavior and their unprovoked aggression you'll frequently hear loaded emotional phrases like my lived experience, standing in my truth, etc.

when definitions are comprised, language is up for grabs and objective reality gets distorted (reality is what we say it is type of thought)

spooky mysticism begets distorted epistemology resulting in societal chaos and it is all up for a power grab

bottom line: it is all about power, who has it, wields it and forces it on the masses to comply with whatever they think society should be

power, forcefully ruling over other humans it is the only thing they know

regards

Keep thinking the good thoughts...maybe one day.

100 years ago, most populations put more faith in the state, relative to the individual.
The liberal view has shifted that, with the individual overriding the state.
Some of that is good, some not so much, 
to your point of standing in my own truth and imposing upon others...postmodernism relativism.



black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 7:14am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

Well, yes, but they are kind of useful, for you can rest assured that the arguments they tout are meant to divert away from the stuff that really upsets their paymasters. 

This whole fear of NATO thing and protecting the geographical borders is actually bullshit. The invading hordes are not on horseback anymore. They come via the internet and with rules-based agreements in their hands.  It's also obvious that geopolitical manoeuvring is not Putin's main reason for the war, as he just opened his entire back door to the Chinese, who will be rubbing their hands in glee.

No, Robert Reich is right at least on this one. What Putin is actually afraid of is the spread of liberal democracy. Look at how repressive the reaction was in Belarus. Now Ukraine. Putin knows his days are numbered and he feels like a cornered rat - and he's acting like one.


Sure, that seems to be the narrative...backwards thinking ideology - MEAGA!
But the west is unwilling to do the one thing that might actually hurt Russia: stop buying their oil.
Because why? Can't get our other "allies" like Saudi Arabia to pump more? Maybe work out a deal with Venezuela? Pump more domestic, or still need to push through the progressive narrative of fossil fuels are evil? 
Seems weak we can't make that type of sacrifice.
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 7:10am

just got a call out on our local kids group looking for billets for the first bus load of kids from Ukraine.

Putin huilo. I mean srsly. 
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 5:30am

 black321 wrote:
 Hmm, MEAGA? (MakeEurAsiaGreatAgain).
Backwards looking, trying and maybe successfully unwinding global progress...though he is right in some cases, like how far gone today's liberals are.  ps., glad you  are safe and hopefully things settle down.
 

coffee thoughts

in the US we have misused liberal and conservative labels out of convenience

there are generally liberal and conservative people, but we shouldn't conflate them with dogmatic radicals on the far right and far left

those radicals (far left and far right) certainly aren't liberal or conservative, they're two sides of the same authoritarian coin

liberal values, which are essentially basic human rights, are at a stark difference with extremists endorsing violence

the challenge with some of the poor reasoning and logic of the post modern believers is there isn't an objective truth

especially when attempting to justify bad behavior and their unprovoked aggression you'll frequently hear loaded emotional phrases like my lived experience, standing in my truth, etc.

when definitions are comprised, language is up for grabs and objective reality gets distorted (reality is what we say it is type of thought)

spooky mysticism begets distorted epistemology resulting in societal chaos and it is all up for a power grab

bottom line: it is all about power, who has it, wields it and forces it on the masses to comply with whatever they think society should be

power, forcefully ruling over other humans it is the only thing they know

regards
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 4:16am

 deltaindia wrote:

Hi. I am ok. Tomorrow maybe I can describe the situation.  All is very hard(( Thank you for your support.



good luck 
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 25, 2022 - 2:34am

Edit: (link seems broken) but there was an announcement that citizens in Kharkiv should shelter in basements

deltaindia could do with some good juju right now.

NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 11:39pm

 deltaindia wrote:
Hi. I am ok. Tomorrow maybe I can describe the situation.  All is very hard(( Thank you for your support.

 
Good to hear you are ok. 
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 11:37pm

 Steely_D wrote:
 whatshisname wrote:

Russia's...

Please don't engage them. They're simply trolling in many forums.
 
Well, yes, but they are kind of useful, for you can rest assured that the arguments they tout are meant to divert away from the stuff that really upsets their paymasters. 

This whole fear of NATO thing and protecting the geographical borders is actually bullshit. The invading hordes are not on horseback anymore. They come via the internet and with rules-based agreements in their hands.  It's also obvious that geopolitical manoeuvring is not Putin's main reason for the war, as he just opened his entire back door to the Chinese, who will be rubbing their hands in glee.

No, Robert Reich is right at least on this one. What Putin is actually afraid of is the spread of liberal democracy. Look at how repressive the reaction was in Belarus. Now Ukraine. Putin knows his days are numbered and he feels like a cornered rat - and he's acting like one.
Animal-Farm

Animal-Farm Avatar



Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 9:09pm

 Steely_D wrote:

Please don't engage them. They're simply trolling in many forums.



Everyone is an equally valid member.
Are you engaging in harassment and bullying?
That's against the rules.
Focus on the debate, not personalities
Thanks
whatshisname

whatshisname Avatar

Location: West OZ
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 7:03pm

 Animal-Farm wrote:


"This war and suffering could have easily been avoided if Biden Admin/NATO had simply acknowledged Russia’s legitimate security concerns regarding Ukraine’s becoming a member of NATO, which would mean US/NATO forces right on Russia’s border"



Russia tries to justify it's aggression against Ukraine as it places yet another potential NATO/OTAN member on Russia's door step.
Will not the current attack on Ukraine ,if successful still bring Russia hard up against borders of existing NATO/OTAN members along with all their forces?
That argument falls short Mr. Putin.
This is more about a corrupt bored-shitless dictator doing a power/land grab of Ukraine's wealth potential.







Antigone

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Location: A house, in a Virginian Valley
Gender: Female


Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 4:16pm

 deltaindia wrote:

Hi. I am ok. Tomorrow maybe I can describe the situation.  All is very hard(( Thank you for your support.





Animal-Farm

Animal-Farm Avatar



Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 3:59pm

appeasement?!?
"This war and suffering could have easily been avoided if Biden Admin/NATO had simply acknowledged Russia’s legitimate security concerns regarding Ukraine’s becoming a member of NATO, which would mean US/NATO forces right on Russia’s border"
WEF's Tulsi Gabbard
Like Putin would be nicer if we were further away? Not likely....

As a reserve officer in the Army not sure why she gets to criticize the commanding officer, perhaps her WEF membership? Putin is WEF too. 
Manbird

Manbird Avatar

Location: Owl Creek Bridge
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 3:41pm

 deltaindia wrote:

Hi. I am ok. Tomorrow maybe I can describe the situation.  All is very hard(( Thank you for your support.





black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 3:34pm

 miamizsun wrote:


posted this in the russia thread about a month ago
===========================================

for me this was sort of difficult to follow (due to accent) while driving, but once seated at home i found it worthwhile

highlights really poor thinking (or thought process) of the extremes
typical pre-modern and post-modern framework
authoritarian rule and an unabashed lack of fidelity to objective science
what could go wrong? ;-)

and this guy is supposedly very influential to putin...









Hmm, MEAGA? (MakeEurAsiaGreatAgain).
Backwards looking, trying and maybe successfully unwinding global progress...though he is right in some cases, like how far gone today's liberals are. 

ps., glad you  are safe and hopefully things settle down.
deltaindia

deltaindia Avatar

Location: Ukraine|Germany


Posted: Feb 24, 2022 - 3:11pm

Hi. I am ok. Tomorrow maybe I can describe the situation.  All is very hard(( Thank you for your support.

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