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260,000 Posts in one thread?
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BRING OUT YOUR DEAD
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Name My Band
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• • • The Once-a-Day • • •
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Lyrics that strike a chord today...
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What the hell OV?
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Song of the Day
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WHY am I so addicted to chocolate???
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Yellowstone is in Wyoming Meetup • Aug. 11 2007 • YEA...
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Things You Thought Today
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NYTimes Connections
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Russia
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Radio Paradise Comments
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As California Goes, So Goes The Rest Of The Country
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Neoliberalism: what exactly is it?
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What makes you smile?
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Things that piss me off
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your music
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Joe Biden
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Photos you have taken of your walks or hikes.
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USA! USA! USA!
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The War On You
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The Obituary Page
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Get the Quote
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Rhetorical questions
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Message To Lucky
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SCOTUS
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2024 Elections!
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Song from the TV series
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songs that ROCK!
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Lyrics that are stuck in your head today...
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Song stuck in your head?
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Play the Blues
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Songs with a Groove
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Climate Change
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RightWingNutZ
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favorite love songs
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Jam! (why should a song stop)
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Amazing animals!
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Vinyl Only Spin List
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Kamala Harris
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Mixtape Culture Club
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Musky Mythology
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YouTube: Music-Videos
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Animal Resistance
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Race in America
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What Makes You Laugh?
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New Music
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Poetry Forum
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Sampled
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Live Music
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• • • What Makes You Happy? • • •
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Kamala Harris
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Europe
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Got my Goat
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Best wishes
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Jon Stewart interview
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Acoustic Guitar
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Gardeners Photos
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Index »
Radio Paradise/General »
General Discussion »
Climate Change
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Page: Previous 1, 2, 3 ... 123, 124, 125 ... 128, 129, 130 Next |
islander
![islander Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/16018-1410630793.png)
Location: West coast somewhere Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:41pm |
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Welly wrote: Well, see you take a tomato, right? And you put it in this mason jar, see?And then you put in a few fruit flies. And then you put on the lid. And you wait. And you watch. Because those fruit flies love that tomato and they, er, love each other too. So they eat and procreate like...well like fruit flies. And eventually the tomato is mostly gone and the jar is full of mostly fruit flies. THE END.
is a grade 5 tomato like a grade A tomato? And all your experiment proves is that under the right conditions a tomato can turn into a fruit fly.
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Welly
![Welly Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/26801-1681090220.jpg)
Location: Lotusland Gender: ![Female](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_female.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:31pm |
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steeler wrote:I did read Lord of the Flies. That plays out here on a daily basis. ![{#Lol} {#Lol}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_lol.gif) ![{#Roflol} {#Roflol}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_roflol.gif) yeah. I know.
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oldviolin
![oldviolin Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/43780-1721913915.jpg)
Location: esse quam videri Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:29pm |
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dionysius wrote:
Having patience with wrongheadedness may be a virtue you possess more than I do, OV. The questions have already mostly been answered; the "doubt" is a politicized, artificial, manufactured thing that has nothing to do with science. Anthropogenic climate change is an unfortunate reality; almost every major published scientific paper on the subject points to it. Unable to produce similar scientific literature on their side, the deniers simply seek to create doubt, cast aspersions on what the actual scientists do, delay and deny. I'm actually not worried about it. The proof, as they say, will be in the pudding. In decades to come, as the sea levels rise, icecaps melt, ocean currents and temperatures change, and weather becomes more and more bizarre, people who now claim the title "skeptic" will then be saying, "Well, I knew it all along." The more things change....
Indeed, and consistantly. I disagree with the notion that all doubt is political in nature, but you would have to be a little more objective than you seem to admit that. Personally, I believe that there is an anthropogenic index, but to the extent that it can be qualified/quantified with absolute integrity has in fact become questionable. It seems that whenever honorable questions do arise from honorable folks with solid reputations, they are discounted out of hand. If I were as in the bank as you seem to be, I would be even more dogged in my need to listen to qualified opposing viewpoints, but that's just me. I guess I attempt to stay out of most of this because I would prefer to listen and learn rather than just roll with the general standards of righteous indignation that passes for truth and limited to ever changing scientific opinion and lag time. Nice stab by the way...Let's hook up on health care or economic recovery some time.
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steeler
![steeler Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/a4529003424b285578cba.gif)
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:28pm |
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Welly wrote: Well, see you take a tomato, right? And you put it in this mason jar, see?And then you put in a few fruit flies. And then you put on the lid. And you wait. And you watch. Because those fruit flies love that tomato and they, er, love each other too. So they eat and procreate like...well like fruit flies. And eventually the tomato is mostly gone and the jar is full of mostly fruit flies. THE END.
I did read Lord of the Flies. That plays out here on a daily basis.
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Welly
![Welly Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/26801-1681090220.jpg)
Location: Lotusland Gender: ![Female](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_female.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:27pm |
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steeler wrote:I think I skipped that day. ![{#Doh} {#Doh}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/eusa_doh.gif) Well, see you take a tomato, right? And you put it in this mason jar, see?And then you put in a few fruit flies. And then you put on the lid. And you wait. And you watch. Because those fruit flies love that tomato and they, er, love each other too. So they eat and procreate like...well like fruit flies. And eventually the tomato is mostly gone and the jar is full of mostly fruit flies. THE END.
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steeler
![steeler Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/a4529003424b285578cba.gif)
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:24pm |
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Welly wrote: The old grade 5 tomato + fruit flies in the mason jar science experiemt, remember?
(And I'm gonna wait for you after school.)
I think I skipped that day.
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steeler
![steeler Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/a4529003424b285578cba.gif)
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:24pm |
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oldviolin wrote: Actually, I think that you under estimate the rationale and intelligence of a lot of folks with that particular attitude. The fact that climate change is a reality over time is hardly in dispute. The argument comes over just what role humanity actually plays in it. I think there is room for discussion without the snide remarks, don't you? There are plenty of questions yet to be answered, the science of tact and political strategy notwithstanding.
Indeed. There was an Ice Age. Wiped out dinosaurs until they became, er, well, dinosaurs. Nothing to worry about. Move along. ![{#Wink} {#Wink}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_wink.gif) Edit: A little more seriously . . . it does seem that there is reason for concern, which is what gets me when those out on the margin argue that it is a hoax.
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Welly
![Welly Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/26801-1681090220.jpg)
Location: Lotusland Gender: ![Female](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_female.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:23pm |
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steeler wrote:Where is your proof of that? Huh? Huh? The old grade 5 tomato + fruit flies in the mason jar science experiemt, remember? (And I'm gonna wait for you after school.)
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steeler
![steeler Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/a4529003424b285578cba.gif)
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:20pm |
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Welly wrote: Meh. We're in complete overshoot. Unless we reduce consumption/growth the system will crash and not much else will matter.Unfortunately there are some who believe the only way forward is to continue growing.It's a hootenany of a debate, that much is for sure.
Where is your proof of that? Huh? Huh?
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Welly
![Welly Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/26801-1681090220.jpg)
Location: Lotusland Gender: ![Female](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_female.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:18pm |
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dionysius wrote: Welly wrote:Another interesting perspective. FWIW, this one is more in line with my thinking.
You radical! ![](graphics/smiles/icon_wave.gif) Meh. We're in complete overshoot. Unless we reduce consumption/growth the system will crash and not much else will matter.Unfortunately there are some who believe the only way forward is to continue growing.It's a hootenany of a debate, that much is for sure.
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dionysius
![dionysius Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/35413.jpg)
Location: The People's Republic of Austin Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:06pm |
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oldviolin wrote: Actually, I think that you under estimate the rationale and intelligence of a lot of folks with that particular attitude. The fact that climate change is a reality over time is hardly in dispute. The argument comes over just what role humanity actually plays in it. I think there is room for discussion without the snide remarks, don't you? There are plenty of questions yet to be answered, the science of tact and political strategy notwithstanding.
Having patience with wrongheadedness may be a virtue you possess more than I do, OV. The questions have already mostly been answered; the "doubt" is a politicized, artificial, manufactured thing that has nothing to do with science. Anthropogenic climate change is an unfortunate reality; almost every major published scientific paper on the subject points to it. Unable to produce similar scientific literature on their side, the deniers simply seek to create doubt, cast aspersions on what the actual scientists do, delay and deny. I'm actually not worried about it. The proof, as they say, will be in the pudding. In decades to come, as the sea levels rise, icecaps melt, ocean currents and temperatures change, and weather becomes more and more bizarre, people who now claim the title "skeptic" will then be saying, "Well, I knew it all along." The more things change....
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islander
![islander Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/16018-1410630793.png)
Location: West coast somewhere Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 5:01pm |
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Beaker wrote: On this topic, are there only two classes of folk in your worldview? Believers and deniers? How about those of us sitting on the fence who acknowledge points made by both sides? What about those of us who want the science to be proven and re-tested, based upon the proven shenanigans? Sounds reasonable to me.
Oh wait. I'll just bet you assume anyone who isn't a believer, by virtue, MUST BE a DENIER! Of course! Silly me.
I'm genuinely curious when I ask this: Have you ever posted anything in support of anthropomorphic climate change? I had thought that the majority of your arguments were "it's a sham foisted on us by the environmentalists". edit: duh s/anthropomorphic/anthropogenic. Although anthropomorphic might be an interesting discussion as well.
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steeler
![steeler Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/a4529003424b285578cba.gif)
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:57pm |
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islander wrote: Absolute proof is only required for items they are opposed to, any issue that aligns with their ideals can be justified w/ any random blog post on the topic.
![{#Lol} {#Lol}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_lol.gif) The only proof worth proving is Absolut!
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oldviolin
![oldviolin Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/43780-1721913915.jpg)
Location: esse quam videri Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:57pm |
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dionysius wrote:
*bump* Folks (those who aren't deniers) should have a look! Love those Danes! (With a shout out to Talalala and Bjørn.)
Actually, deniers need to look the most.
Actually, I think that you under estimate the rationale and intelligence of a lot of folks with that particular attitude. The fact that climate change is a reality over time is hardly in dispute. The argument comes over just what role humanity actually plays in it. I think there is room for discussion without the snide remarks, don't you? There are plenty of questions yet to be answered, the science of tact and political strategy notwithstanding.
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dionysius
![dionysius Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/35413.jpg)
Location: The People's Republic of Austin Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:45pm |
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dionysius wrote:Starting today! We can follow the proceedings of the Copenhagen Conference online here. Click on the "Denmark's Efforts" tab to learn a few interesting things the host country is doing towards a greener and more sustainable economy. The Danes' determination and drive on these issues over a broad front is pretty inspiring. *bump* Folks ( those who aren't deniers) should have a look! Love those Danes! (With a shout out to Talalala and Bjørn.) Actually, deniers need to look the most.
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islander
![islander Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/16018-1410630793.png)
Location: West coast somewhere Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:38pm |
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steeler wrote:The demand for absolute proof certain of global warming amuses and mystyifies me, especially when those demands come from persons who devotedly and absolutely believe in God or some other superior being or force. ![{#Whisper} {#Whisper}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_whisper.gif) That's just fuzzy science . . . hey, Santa's coming in a couple weeks! Absolute proof is only required for items they are opposed to, any issue that aligns with their ideals can be justified w/ any random blog post on the topic.
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steeler
![steeler Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/a4529003424b285578cba.gif)
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:28pm |
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oldviolin wrote:I think the proof of lack of objectivity is what amuses me. Otherwise the argument would be lost on common sense with regards to the very real and documentable issues of air, water, and noise pollution, the latter ramping up considerably most recently. By the way, God told me to write that. ![{#Wink} {#Wink}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_wink.gif)
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oldviolin
![oldviolin Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/43780-1721913915.jpg)
Location: esse quam videri Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:26pm |
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steeler wrote:The demand for absolute proof certain of global warming amuses and mystyifies me, especially when those demands come from persons who devotedly and absolutely believe in God or some other superior being or force. ![{#Whisper} {#Whisper}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_whisper.gif) That's just fuzzy science . . . hey, Santa's coming in a couple weeks! I think the proof of lack of objectivity is what amuses me. Otherwise the argument would be lost on common sense with regards to the very real and documentable issues of air, water, and noise pollution, the latter ramping up considerably most recently. By the way, God told me to write that.
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Lazy8
![Lazy8 Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/23094.jpg)
Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:18pm |
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Beaker wrote:WOW."The determination gives the EPA wide-ranging authority over the operations of energy production and manufacturing:" "Don’t kid yourself into thinking the EPA doesn’t understand the scope of its power. By classifying CO2 and methane (among other so-called greenhouse gases, it can inject itself into just about every industry in the US. Energy production will be its primary target, but the EPA has also gone after coal mining on the basis of the Clean Water Act; it will certainly not be shy about using this new authority to kill coal mining altogether. It will also impact agriculture, especially dairies and cattle ranching, as well as transportation. The entire manufacturing sector will have to answer for its output." Yes it will. There's this little thing called "Congress", see...
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steeler
![steeler Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/a4529003424b285578cba.gif)
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Dec 7, 2009 - 4:13pm |
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The demand for absolute proof certain of global warming amuses and mystyifies me, especially when those demands come from persons who devotedly and absolutely believe in God or some other superior being or force. ![{#Whisper} {#Whisper}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_whisper.gif) That's just fuzzy science . . . hey, Santa's coming in a couple weeks!
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