This is an important point that mostly gets overlooked in the "discussions" here.
Many - repubs, dems, independents - see some on the right holding Trump up as the new messiah and shake their head and ask, what?
(H/C)opium of the masses.
People who voted for Trump are a minority (77.2M out of 246.6M/264.7M possible voters).
Yes it is. You never see any criticism of the Democratic Party... do you see anyone saying it's just the greatest thing ever? I can't remember the last time I saw someone saying (here or anywhere) that the Democratic Party represented their position perfectly. Stop trying to make "us" black or white and "you" nuanced and varied shades of gray.
This is an important point that mostly gets overlooked in the "discussions" here.
Many - repubs, dems, independents - see some on the right holding Trump up as the new messiah and shake their head and ask, what?
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth
Posted:
Dec 5, 2024 - 9:35am
kurtster wrote:
. . .
The repub party has finally evolved into something that represents a broad coalition of the abandoned joined by a common goal(s) that no one in the democratic party seems to want any part of.
. .
Based on the presidential election results, the âabandonedâ are the majority. That should mean the end of the endless, spurious claims of victimhood, of being neglected, dismissed, and abused by âcoastal elitesâ and other gibberish.
I see the thoughts of joining the republican party in order to change it into something else. Why ? Narcissism is my first guess.
Was your second guess "Free Potatoes"? Maybe "best adhesive for plastic"? Those make as much sense.
Who would want to join the party they see as undereducated, fascist, racist, homophobic, xenophobic, misogynistic, etc. and allow themselves to be called all of these things ?
You said it. I used to switch over when friends were running etc. but I won't anymore. I refuse to join any club that would have me you as a member.
The elephant in the room is, is there something wrong with the democratic party that makes you want to leave and change the republican party into something it does not want to be ?
It worked for the Tea Party
The repub party has finally evolved into something that represents a broad coalition of the abandoned joined by a common goal(s) that no one in the democratic party seems to want any part of.
You got that right 100%.
Is the democratic party so broken that it is beyond repair ? Is that why ? Must be something else because I never see any criticism of the party here.
Yes it is. You never see any criticism of the Democratic Party... do you see anyone saying it's just the greatest thing ever? I can't remember the last time I saw someone saying (here or anywhere) that the Democratic Party represented their position perfectly. Stop trying to make "us" black or white and "you" nuanced and varied shades of gray.
How about all you from that side of the aisle stay in your party and try and fix it instead ?
These are the rules you agreed to. Note that Wyoming has ratcheted down the ability for voters to easily switch parties. This was intended to prevent Democrats from reregistering as GOP to vote for the lesser of 2 or 3 evils. The fallout from that is that the Wyoming GOP has never had higher membership. Many who used to switch and switch back... never switched back. So now they have a bunch of Democrats who won't ever un-register as Republicans, so they'll be skewing results of every election down to dogcatcher, not just the interesting primaries.
My ears are burning. But then, this is all about me me me, so I guess that's a reasonable criticism.
Thinking that trying to put a micro-dent in a party that's demonstrably bad for Americans is about ME? That's not really logical.
Despite the contention that it hurts more than it helps (like anyone in the GOP is paying attention to anything I say; I'm just there for the vote) I see it as - in lieu of dragging my trick knee and short attention span our to a protest that doesn't really do anything - a very very small version of protest.
I know it won't really move a needle. THAT would be narcissistic (which is the kids' buzzword these days).
But folks that are looking at this with a bit of perspective see that the GOP holds the reins to power and decision making for the moment until they inevitably split into sects like the Protestants. Trying to make any kind of influence in that cult by being a non-GOP is much harder than being a member of the cult and throwing in a periodically rational voice during cocktail hour.
Just like the debates on RP, will it make a difference? Very very doubtful. Silly to believe it. But you know, if one person, just one person does it they may think he's really sick, and they won't take him. And if two people, two people do itâin harmonyâthey may think they're both gay and they won't take either of 'em.
And three people do itâthree, can you imagine?âthree people walking in, singing a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out?âthey may think it's an organization.
And can youâcan you imagine fifty people a dayâI said fifty people a day!âwalkin' in, singin' a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out.
And friends, they may think it's a movement!
And that's what it is.
Page 67 of the top secret (every gets one except Kurt) RP forum handbook states that we always hate republicans. It's not about policy, it's about fealty to the party.
But I'll still sing a few bars with you, what key? Got to stop war and stuff, right?
I see the thoughts of joining the republican party in order to change it into something else. Why ? Narcissism is my first guess.
My ears are burning. But then, this is all about me me me, so I guess that's a reasonable criticism.
Thinking that trying to put a micro-dent in a party that's demonstrably bad for Americans is about ME? That's not really logical.
Despite the contention that it hurts more than it helps (like anyone in the GOP is paying attention to anything I say; I'm just there for the vote) I see it as - in lieu of dragging my trick knee and short attention span our to a protest that doesn't really do anything - a very very small version of protest.
I know it won't really move a needle. THAT would be narcissistic (which is the kids' buzzword these days).
But folks that are looking at this with a bit of perspective see that the GOP holds the reins to power and decision making for the moment until they inevitably split into sects like the Protestants. Trying to make any kind of influence in that cult by being a non-GOP is much harder than being a member of the cult and throwing in a periodically rational voice during cocktail hour while they tut-tut about the problem of those people.
Just like the debates on RP, will it make a difference? Very very doubtful. Silly to believe it. But you know, if one person, just one person does it they may think he's really sick, and they won't take him. And if two people, two people do itâin harmonyâthey may think they're both gay and they won't take either of 'em.
And three people do itâthree, can you imagine?âthree people walking in, singing a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out?âthey may think it's an organization.
And can youâcan you imagine fifty people a dayâI said fifty people a day!âwalkin' in, singin' a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out.
And friends, they may think it's a movement!
I see the thoughts of joining the republican party in order to change it into something else. Why ? Narcissism is my first guess.
Who would want to join the party they see as undereducated, fascist, racist, homophobic, xenophobic, misogynistic, etc. and allow themselves to be called all of these things ?
The elephant in the room is, is there something wrong with the democratic party that makes you want to leave and change the republican party into something it does not want to be ?
The repub party has finally evolved into something that represents a broad coalition of the abandoned joined by a common goal(s) that no one in the democratic party seems to want any part of.
Is the democratic party so broken that it is beyond repair ? Is that why ? Must be something else because I never see any criticism of the party here.
How about all you from that side of the aisle stay in your party and try and fix it instead ?
What about those of us who left the Republican party when it became overrun with undereducated, fascist, racist, homophobic, xenophobic, misogynistic minions who ignore facts and science to follow the ramblings or a truly horrible human being? The remaining "party" is where the RINOs have amassed. No sense of tomorrow... everything is about taking whatever you can get today.
The elephant in the room remains your inability to either see or accept what's wrong in the Republican party. That doesn't make me a Democrat.
I see the thoughts of joining the republican party in order to change it into something else. Why ? Narcissism is my first guess.
Who would want to join the party they see as undereducated, fascist, racist, homophobic, xenophobic, misogynistic, etc. and allow themselves to be called all of these things ?
The elephant in the room is, is there something wrong with the democratic party that makes you want to leave and change the republican party into something it does not want to be ?
The repub party has finally evolved into something that represents a broad coalition of the abandoned joined by a common goal(s) that no one in the democratic party seems to want any part of.
Is the democratic party so broken that it is beyond repair ? Is that why ? Must be something else because I never see any criticism of the party here.
How about all you from that side of the aisle stay in your party and try and fix it instead ?
People will join the political party that suits them best, Kurt.
There are many unhappy Republicans and former Republicans. The party has devolved into a slavish cult of personality around Trump and seems energized by his encouragement of FUD and hate.
The party used to be reasonable and tolerant. It was run by people like Dwight Eisenhower. It might be preferable if you had two parties willing to use government policy and power to make life more prosperous, fairer and more secure for all Americans. Right now we have Trump and his flunkeys gearing up to get very, very rich at the expense of people like you.
Not everyone wants what the Dems are selling. It doesn't mean that they have sit quietly and do whatever Trump tells them to do. I think they'd rather leave that to you.
I see the thoughts of joining the republican party in order to change it into something else. Why ? Narcissism is my first guess.
Who would want to join the party they see as undereducated, fascist, racist, homophobic, xenophobic, misogynistic, etc. and allow themselves to be called all of these things ?
The elephant in the room is, is there something wrong with the democratic party that makes you want to leave and change the republican party into something it does not want to be ?
The repub party has finally evolved into something that represents a broad coalition of the abandoned joined by a common goal(s) that no one in the democratic party seems to want any part of.
Is the democratic party so broken that it is beyond repair ? Is that why ? Must be something else because I never see any criticism of the party here.
How about all you from that side of the aisle stay in your party and try and fix it instead ?
:sniff:sniff: MOM! That girl at school was mean to me again and called me a poopy-head and stuffed me into a locker and I missed my first period math test until the janitor heard me crying and let me out. Right after that some bullies gave me a wedgie and took me to the bathroom and gave me swirlies until it looked like I was going to pass out and then they told me to ask you if you had any children that lived and then during recess they pushed my head to the ground and made me lick white dog poop. Totally not fair.
:sniff:sniff: MOM! That girl at school was mean to me again and called me a poopy-head and stuffed me into a locker and I missed my first period math test until the janitor heard me crying and let me out. Right after that some bullies gave me a wedgie and took me to the bathroom and gave me swirlies until it looked like I was going to pass out and then they told me to ask you if you had any children that lived and then during recess they pushed my head to the ground and made me lick white dog poop. Totally not fair.
I really thought the "Tea Party" would have enough clout to swing some elections and become their own thing, but nobody wanted to abandon the cash flowing thru the party. The dyed-in-the-wool GOP people who wouldn't have ever joined the Tea Party need to leave the GOP to them.
And there it is. Ironically, Richard Millhouse fucking Nixon (king of the rat bastards) was our closest shot at both Universal Basic Income and the ouster of the electoral college. He would almost be forgiven if he had...
Yeah, the problem is it is much easier to drag a party to the extreme, than it is to nudge it toward the middle. Compromise rarely 'feels' good, so it's easy to fight.
I get the allure of working with established systems, but we are really ripe for some new parties. If they came to be, a lot of the disenfranchised leftovers would likely consider jumping ship. (no, Greens, Libertarians, social dems... aren't new parties. Maybe they are ineffective (well, technically the Greens have won some elections, just not for themselves) because of the power of the big two, or maybe they just aren't the right parties. Bring on the factions, bring on the coalitions.
I really thought the "Tea Party" would have enough clout to swing some elections and become their own thing, but nobody wanted to abandon the cash flowing thru the party. The dyed-in-the-wool GOP people who wouldn't have ever joined the Tea Party need to leave the GOP to them.
Registered Democrats here are dismissed (rightly so, we make up about 12% statewide) but RINOs get death threats. A lot of people are RINO, literally, because the election is usually decided in the primary. The other class of RINO are the ones who have been GOP their entire life but haven't moved to the right as that segment swelled, so now they're out of step with party platforms.
tl;dr: infiltrating the party might just push the party further to the right.
Yeah, the problem is it is much easier to drag a party to the extreme, than it is to nudge it toward the middle. Compromise rarely 'feels' good, so it's easy to fight.
I get the allure of working with established systems, but we are really ripe for some new parties. If they came to be, a lot of the disenfranchised leftovers would likely consider jumping ship. (no, Greens, Libertarians, social dems... aren't new parties. Maybe they are ineffective (well, technically the Greens have won some elections, just not for themselves) because of the power of the big two, or maybe they just aren't the right parties. Bring on the factions, bring on the coalitions.
Ain't nothing gonna change if Democrats sit back and watch. There are probably reasonable non-Trump Republicans alive somewhere. The start, IMHO, is to infiltrate the party and be a rational, non-cult voice towards smaller government without religious fealty or thoughtless subservience to a wannabe fascist.
Still registered in CA, so it really means nothing, but I renewed the driver's license and they asked my party, so I changed.
Registered Democrats here are dismissed (rightly so, we make up about 12% statewide) but RINOs get death threats. A lot of people are RINO, literally, because the election is usually decided in the primary. The other class of RINO are the ones who have been GOP their entire life but haven't moved to the right as that segment swelled, so now they're out of step with party platforms.
tl;dr: infiltrating the party might just push the party further to the right.
Ain't nothing gonna change if Democrats sit back and watch. There are probably reasonable non-Trump Republicans alive somewhere. The start, IMHO, is to infiltrate the party and be a rational, non-cult voice towards smaller government without religious fealty or thoughtless subservience to a wannabe fascist.
Still registered in CA, so it really means nothing, but I renewed the driver's license and they asked my party, so I changed.
That's an interesting tactic. You might remember, however, that the GOP had many reasonable, intelligent and informed conservative supporters before Trump. Their collective "rational, non-cult voice" got drowned out and silenced.
Would you consider switching to Democrat or Independent and trying to move the party (or its local representatives) closer to your values and ideas?
Ain't nothing gonna change if Democrats sit back and watch. There are probably reasonable non-Trump Republicans alive somewhere. The start, IMHO, is to infiltrate the party and be a rational, non-cult voice towards smaller government without religious fealty or thoughtless subservience to a wannabe fascist.
Still registered in CA, so it really means nothing, but I renewed the driver's license and they asked my party, so I changed.
Ain't nothing gonna change if Democrats sit back and watch. There are probably reasonable non-Trump Republicans alive somewhere. The start, IMHO, is to infiltrate the party and be a rational, non-cult voice towards smaller government without religious fealty or thoughtless subservience to a wannabe fascist.
Still registered in CA, so it really means nothing, but I renewed the driver's license and they asked my party, so I changed.
