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ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 2, 2022 - 2:30pm

 steeler wrote:

He was released on May 24 after having back surgery and had been complaining about back pain. A week after being released, he goes and kills the surgeon who operated on him (and others), presumably because of the back pain. The kicker: he bought the semi-automatic rifle he used that morning.
.
Seems to me this scenario presents an argument for a waiting period of, say, at least three days between arranging purchase and obtaining the firearm. A waiting period may not stop a person like this guy from acting on his grievance, but a “cooling off period” possibly could prevent at least a few of these. And what is the downside? It seems to me that anyone who has an “urgent” need for a gun right away is likely to be someone who intends to use it on someone. That urgency, if expressed or otherwise made known, should be a red flag in and of itself.






steeler

steeler Avatar

Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth


Posted: Jun 2, 2022 - 10:31am

 Red_Dragon wrote:
He was released on May 24 after having back surgery and had been complaining about back pain. A week after being released, he goes and kills the surgeon who operated on him (and others), presumably because of the back pain. The kicker: he bought the semi-automatic rifle he used that morning.
.
Seems to me this scenario presents an argument for a waiting period of, say, at least three days between arranging purchase and obtaining the firearm. A waiting period may not stop a person like this guy from acting on his grievance, but a “cooling off period” possibly could prevent at least a few of these. And what is the downside? It seems to me that anyone who has an “urgent” need for a gun right away is likely to be someone who intends to use it on someone. That urgency, if expressed or otherwise made known, should be a red flag in and of itself.

Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 2, 2022 - 10:08am

The suspect "came in with the intent to kill Dr. Phillips and anyone who came in his way," Franklin said. Authorities found a letter on Lewis that made it clear that the attack was targeted...."
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 2, 2022 - 8:33am

 kurtster wrote:

What, some alarm bells go off in one of your feeds or were you assigned to watch her tonight ?  

That's pretty funny.  Not sure what others get, but I have one daily feed and it's a business report on press releases.   Who needs politics in a feed?

I watch Fox every so often.  Primarily Tucker (for as long as I can put up with him).  It gives me a chance to prepare for the online regurgitation. 

You rarely, if ever, let me down.

NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 11:49pm

 kurtster wrote:
regarding the partisan divide on guns.

the left wants no guns, period.

the right wants to keep their guns as guaranteed by the 2nd amendment.

the left pretends to try and find a middle ground under the guise of gun control.

when the right brings up the blatant failures of gun control, the left just says we need more laws.

when the right brings up the failures of gun laws in places like Chicago as an example of how the most stringent laws do not work, at all, the left changes the subject and refuses to acknowledge the blatant failures let alone even discuss them.

when the right finds that the left does not want to discuss the failure of gun laws other than to say we need more laws and that will fix everything, the right does not take the left seriously on the issue.  especially when the laws on the books are hardly even enforced anymore.  only a fool would believe that more laws that will not be enforced will solve the problem.

the lack of enforcement is taken to be intentional by the right.  the lack of enforcement is done so the left can say, see we have all these laws and they do not work,  we need to confiscate the guns as it is the only sure way to fix the problem.

and here we are.

imo ...
 
Some of these claims appear to be pretty, um, sloppy:
  • no guns, period?  really?   not even justified use like in Australia, as Haresfur explained?
  • 2nd amendment .. you appear to be ignoring the prefatory clause here. There is a purpose and context to the "right to bear arms".
  • blatant failures of gun control so we don't need more gun control laws - yet gun control works fine in almost all other countries, why not in the States?
  • the left is intentionally not enforcing existing gun control laws so as to introduce a ban - this sounds a) outlandish and b) contradicts the very argument you made in the preceding paragraph, that gun control laws don't work per se.
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 11:00pm

 R_P wrote:
 
yeah, I saw this live.  and no, I do not agree.

This is fresh roadkill.  Mere hours old.

What, some alarm bells go off in one of your feeds or were you assigned to watch her tonight ?  
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 10:53pm


kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 10:19pm

regarding the partisan divide on guns.

the left wants no guns, period.

the right wants to keep their guns as guaranteed by the 2nd amendment.

the left pretends to try and find a middle ground under the guise of gun control.

when the right brings up the blatant failures of gun control, the left just says we need more laws.

when the right brings up the failures of gun laws in places like Chicago as an example of how the most stringent laws do not work, at all, the left changes the subject and refuses to acknowledge the blatant failures let alone even discuss them.

when the right finds that the left does not want to discuss the failure of gun laws other than to say we need more laws and that will fix everything, the right does not take the left seriously on the issue.  especially when the laws on the books are hardly even enforced anymore.  only a fool would believe that more laws that will not be enforced will solve the problem.

the lack of enforcement is taken to be intentional by the right.  the lack of enforcement is done so the left can say, see we have all these laws and they do not work,  we need to confiscate the guns as it is the only sure way to fix the problem.

and here we are.

imo ...
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 9:36pm

Interesting piece in the Guardian
In 2018, CNN investigated school shootings worldwide between 2009 and 2018. The US, as it turns out, has “57 times as many shootings as the other six G7 countries combined”. What an appalling statistic.

...When you moved to a colony as a settler, Hannah Arendt observed long ago, you freed yourself from the morality of your home country and acted any way you wished, as long as you had your carbine by your side. Colonizers were “functionaries of violence”, Arendt explains, able to define themselves both by their opposition to their home country and by their brutal subjugation of the natives around them. This particular kind of colonial arrogance sounds familiar. In American mythology, we call it rugged individualism. 
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 7:05pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:

Somebody just shot up a medical complex in Tulsa; 3 more sacrifices to the gun god - plus the shooter.



Now it's 4 dead plus the shooter, who seems to have died by his own hand.
Antigone

Antigone Avatar

Location: A house, in a Virginian Valley
Gender: Female


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 5:42pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:
Somebody just shot up a medical complex in Tulsa; 3 more sacrifices to the gun god - plus the shooter.
 
That’s the hospital where my friend, who was raped and beaten, was treated. She hasn’t checked in, and I’m concerned about her. She’s out of the hospital, but obviously still getting treated for her serious injuries. 
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 5:14pm

Somebody just shot up a medical complex in Tulsa; 3 more sacrifices to the gun god - plus the shooter.
islander

islander Avatar

Location: Seattle
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 5:13pm

 oldviolin wrote:

Dang. I must be losing my touch...
{#Wink}


A broken clock falls on a blind squirrel once in a blue moon. 
haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 4:03pm

 Jiggz wrote:



Baseball bats? Cricket bats? Chainsaws? Hammers? Hatchets? Socks stuffed with flashlight batteries? Cars? Rocks or stones? Catapults? Rat poison? Fence posts? 2by4's? Meat cleavers? Paring knives? What about empty bottles?
Fire extinguishers?
Razor blades?
Aerosol cans that can turn into mini flamethrowers?
Swimming pool acid?


OK - that's your vision of the world you want to create and live in. I think you are misguided.

"You can only possess or carry weapons if you do so safely"....sounds ok, with exceptions, much like your firearms laws as far as I understand them.

Still doesn't solve what appears to be an almost uniquely US problem of a medicated, sad, lonely crazy person wanting to do harm to a bunch of other innocents.
I guess in your world that couldn't possibly be worth examining as a problem. 
Keep on pissing into the gale....keep infringing on the personal liberties of everyone because of the actions of very few....and enjoy what comes to you.
As I said - I think you are misguided, but I suppose the Kool-Aid was tasty.

It's my vision of the world I do live in and it's not too bad. Look, I do have some differences of opinion, like I think carrying a Swiss Army knife just because you think you might need it is no big deal and I get nervous when you leave too much to the discretion of the police but overall it works. If you are a chef heading to work with your knife roll, no big deal; if you are some rando waving a cleaver around in the central business district, the police can and will stop you. 

Yeah, lots of things can be turned into weapons but they aren't optimal weapons. The general principles are to make it hard and to minimise the damage. I'd rather face someone with an aerosol can than an AK-47.

I suppose you have a point about the medication. If a million people can't be productive members of society because they are too depressed to do anything at all, they probably won't have the energy to shoot up a school. Talk about infringing on freedom.

kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 3:24pm

 oldviolin wrote:

Hatred is a product of fear, and fear is increasingly nurtured in the arena of instant information. IOW, the algorithm of fear haunts the world of knowledge by using the input of personal insecurity against it....
 
Well put.  I'll just add that fear is a primal emotion and easily exploited and nurtured as you mention.

I will note one exception, broccoli.  So many people seem to hate it.  Probably because it is good for you ... {#Wink}
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 1:53pm

The 25-count indictment includes both first-degree murder charges and second-degree murder charges as hate crimes, as well as three counts of attempted murder and single counts of gun and domestic terrorism charges. Mr. Gendron has pleaded not guilty.

Mr. Gendron, an avowed white supremacist, is accused of shooting 13 people, almost all of them Black, at a Tops supermarket in a largely Black section of Buffalo, New York’s second largest city. Three of those shot on that Saturday afternoon survived the attack, which was one of the worst racist massacres in recent American history.

oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 1:21pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:
 oldviolin wrote:

Hatred is a product of fear, and fear is increasingly nurtured in the arena of instant information. IOW, the algorithm of fear haunts the world of knowledge by using the input of personal insecurity against it....
Holy shit, I get that!
 
Dang. I must be losing my touch...{#Wink}
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 12:31pm

 oldviolin wrote:

Hatred is a product of fear, and fear is increasingly nurtured in the arena of instant information. IOW, the algorithm of fear haunts the world of knowledge by using the input of personal insecurity against it....


Holy shit, I get that!
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 12:08pm

 steeler wrote:
If, as it appears from your posts, this is more a uniquely American problem due, in your estimation, to a over-medicated populace, why do you think almost all other “westernized” countries have way more restrictions on gun ownership/possession?

*Cough* Portugal *Cough*

oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 1, 2022 - 11:37am

 kurtster wrote:


In this context, I would go with hate is a learned thing, a function of nurture.
 
Hatred is a product of fear, and fear is increasingly nurtured in the arena of instant information. IOW, the algorithm of fear haunts the world of knowledge by using the input of personal insecurity against it....
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