[ ]   [ ]   [ ]                        [ ]      [ ]   [ ]

TV shows you watch - kcar - Jun 5, 2023 - 10:50pm
 
Ukraine - kcar - Jun 5, 2023 - 10:45pm
 
Wordle - daily game - NoEnzLefttoSplit - Jun 5, 2023 - 9:26pm
 
What Makes You Laugh? - Coaxial - Jun 5, 2023 - 6:14pm
 
Derplahoma! - Red_Dragon - Jun 5, 2023 - 4:28pm
 
The Obituary Page - Red_Dragon - Jun 5, 2023 - 4:27pm
 
Song of the Day - Manbird - Jun 5, 2023 - 3:32pm
 
Independent Party Candidates - Red_Dragon - Jun 5, 2023 - 3:19pm
 
June 2023 Photo Theme - Lines - parallel, converging, cur... - Antigone - Jun 5, 2023 - 2:40pm
 
Trump - rgio - Jun 5, 2023 - 1:58pm
 
Radio Paradise Comments - Beez - Jun 5, 2023 - 12:16pm
 
Get the Quote - Isabeau - Jun 5, 2023 - 10:29am
 
• • • The Once-a-Day • • •  - oldviolin - Jun 5, 2023 - 9:14am
 
Mixtape Culture Club - Steely_D - Jun 5, 2023 - 9:07am
 
New Music - miamizsun - Jun 5, 2023 - 8:06am
 
• • • BRING OUT YOUR DEAD • • •  - oldviolin - Jun 5, 2023 - 7:52am
 
A Picture paints a thousand words - oldviolin - Jun 5, 2023 - 7:48am
 
May 2023 Photo Theme - Buds, Sprouts & Beginnings - sunybuny - Jun 5, 2023 - 7:22am
 
Today in History - Red_Dragon - Jun 5, 2023 - 5:42am
 
Talk Behind Their Backs Forum - lily34 - Jun 5, 2023 - 5:33am
 
Movie Recommendation - ScottFromWyoming - Jun 4, 2023 - 9:59pm
 
Tindersticks - oldviolin - Jun 4, 2023 - 8:53pm
 
just like old rario - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jun 4, 2023 - 7:41pm
 
Out the window - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jun 4, 2023 - 7:34pm
 
Things You Thought Today - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jun 4, 2023 - 7:31pm
 
One Partying State - Wyoming News - geoff_morphini - Jun 4, 2023 - 1:48pm
 
Skeptix - R_P - Jun 4, 2023 - 12:04pm
 
Name My Band - GeneP59 - Jun 4, 2023 - 10:29am
 
USA! USA! USA! - R_P - Jun 4, 2023 - 10:22am
 
ONE WORD - Red_Dragon - Jun 3, 2023 - 4:48pm
 
What Did You Do Today? - Antigone - Jun 3, 2023 - 4:40pm
 
FOUR WORDS - GeneP59 - Jun 3, 2023 - 4:25pm
 
THREE WORDS - GeneP59 - Jun 3, 2023 - 4:24pm
 
TWO WORDS - GeneP59 - Jun 3, 2023 - 4:23pm
 
Guns - R_P - Jun 3, 2023 - 1:34pm
 
Lyrics That Remind You of Someone - oldviolin - Jun 3, 2023 - 10:56am
 
Counting with Pictures - ScottN - Jun 2, 2023 - 8:28pm
 
Puzzle it - oldviolin - Jun 2, 2023 - 2:04pm
 
Fascism In America - R_P - Jun 2, 2023 - 1:24pm
 
(Big) Media Watch - R_P - Jun 2, 2023 - 12:43pm
 
China - R_P - Jun 2, 2023 - 12:26pm
 
Musky Mythology - Proclivities - Jun 2, 2023 - 11:50am
 
Climate Change - R_P - Jun 2, 2023 - 11:09am
 
Country Up The Bumpkin - oldviolin - Jun 2, 2023 - 9:21am
 
What Makes You Cry :) ? - Beez - Jun 2, 2023 - 9:00am
 
Bad Poetry - oldviolin - Jun 2, 2023 - 8:39am
 
Allergies ( aka pollen hell) - black321 - Jun 2, 2023 - 8:02am
 
Food Democracy - Proclivities - Jun 2, 2023 - 6:23am
 
Canada - westslope - Jun 2, 2023 - 12:57am
 
Rock mix no longer available in Denmark - klausf - Jun 1, 2023 - 11:37pm
 
Dialing 1-800-Manbird - oldviolin - Jun 1, 2023 - 9:00pm
 
RightWingNutZ - R_P - Jun 1, 2023 - 4:32pm
 
Republican Wingnut Freak of the Day - Red_Dragon - Jun 1, 2023 - 3:56pm
 
Artificial Intelligence - R_P - Jun 1, 2023 - 12:38pm
 
Pernicious Pious Proclivities Particularized Prodigiously - R_P - Jun 1, 2023 - 10:56am
 
Come join us in Eureka! - lily34 - Jun 1, 2023 - 5:10am
 
RP in a Tesla EV - miamizsun - Jun 1, 2023 - 4:37am
 
21 - ScottFromWyoming - May 31, 2023 - 2:27pm
 
Russia - westslope - May 31, 2023 - 6:56am
 
Outstanding Covers - Steely_D - May 30, 2023 - 9:35am
 
Bug Reports & Feature Requests - renaultr17 - May 29, 2023 - 9:50pm
 
Helpful emergency signs - Proclivities - May 29, 2023 - 7:14am
 
Eversolo DMP-A6 streamer and RP? - William - May 28, 2023 - 8:36pm
 
MQA in administration - William - May 28, 2023 - 8:27pm
 
Stream stopping at promo - William - May 28, 2023 - 8:18pm
 
What's your favorite quote? - maryte - May 28, 2023 - 9:12am
 
Ask for a tea - DaveInSaoMiguel - May 28, 2023 - 3:29am
 
Graphic designers, ho's! - Manbird - May 27, 2023 - 5:43pm
 
Lyrics that are stuck in your head today... - ScottN - May 27, 2023 - 5:28pm
 
Animal Resistance - Red_Dragon - May 27, 2023 - 7:46am
 
Little known information...maybe even facts - miamizsun - May 27, 2023 - 7:24am
 
You're welcome, manbird. - Bill_J - May 26, 2023 - 6:00pm
 
In My Room - KurtfromLaQuinta - May 26, 2023 - 4:17pm
 
The Lincoln quote ... wasn't from Lincoln - Proclivities - May 26, 2023 - 1:19pm
 
Live Music - Steely_D - May 26, 2023 - 10:51am
 
Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » Artificial Intelligence Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Post to this Topic
Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 1:44pm

 Proclivities wrote:

Maybe we will be able to set filters or parameters:  "I'll only take calls from Paul Harvey or Scatman Crothers...etc...."

Bob Newhart
or Ellen Degeneres


ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 1:44pm

 Proclivities wrote:

Maybe we will be able to set filters or parameters:  "I'll only take calls from Paul Harvey or Scatman Crothers...etc...."


Marilyn Monroe 9 calls out of 10; Gilbert Gottfried thrown in just to keep you on your toes.
oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 1:40pm

 Proclivities wrote:

Maybe we will be able to set filters or parameters:  "I'll only take calls from Paul Harvey or Scatman Crothers...etc...."


Ooh. Groucho. Or Rodney. You know. In case grins are the flavor of the moment. Hey, artificial jokes. Who knew?

uh oh. Like minds think alike.

Give that man a ceegar!
Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 1:35pm

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:


Yep, if you want. Maybe if you don't want.

Maybe we will be able to set filters or parameters:  "I'll only take calls from Paul Harvey or Scatman Crothers...etc...."
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 1:06pm

 Proclivities wrote:

Yikes!  Does that mean we're going to start getting robo-calls from the likes of Groucho Marx, Paul Robeson, and Ronald Reagan?


Yep, if you want. Maybe if you don't want.
Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 1:05pm

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

just off the top of my head, some of the implications:

  • there will be a blurring of reality and digital reality.. authenticity in the digital world will lose all meaning.   maybe this  means we start spending more time outdoors 
  • this might have psychological implications for us far more than is already the case with VR. Now we can resurrect the dead, mirror the mannerisms and thought patterns - that is just going to be plain weird...

Yikes!  Does that mean we're going to start getting robo-calls from the likes of Groucho Marx, Paul Robeson, and Ronald Reagan?
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 12:05pm

just off the top of my head, some of the implications:
  • there will be a blurring of reality and digital reality.. authenticity in the digital world will lose all meaning.   maybe this  means we start spending more time outdoors 
  • this might have psychological implications for us far more than is already the case with VR. Now we can resurrect the dead, mirror the mannerisms and thought patterns - that is just going to be plain weird
  • there will be massive productivity gains  .. I think this is the step that really does unleash unbounded productivity and frees us from the "shackles of labor" BUT
  • that will imply massive social realignment. We evolved over millions of years competing over scarce resources.. that particular branch of the evolutionary tree may have just come to an end. scarcity will become micromanaged. risk will change its meaning.
  • the distribution of wealth suddenly takes on a whole new significance.. who is going to benefit from the newly created abundance? Will it be even possible to patent proprietary rights, when the machines do 99% of the creating? Will that even mean anything? 
  • will we as a species adjust to abundance or just die of boredom?  "Hey bot, re-engineer the sabre tooth tiger."

Beaker

Beaker Avatar

Location: Your safe space


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 11:45am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

I agree.


NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 11:42am

 Beaker wrote:

It's a bigger deal than the emergence of the iPhone. Or Google.
It will revolutionize everything.




I agree.
Beaker

Beaker Avatar

Location: Your safe space


Posted: Mar 24, 2023 - 10:53am

It's a bigger deal than the emergence of the iPhone. Or Google.
It will revolutionize everything.

miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 10:46am

probably worth your time
but you'll need to listen...



rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 7:11am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:
...
The biggest problem, as I see it,  is the associated dumbing down of the audience that you refer to. A lot of younger translators are now forced to use machine translations (for cost reasons) but they just don't see the mistakes the machine makes. So over time a wrong translation becomes standard. ...
...

That is the situation that all businesses face right now, and it's a bit of a chicken and egg.  It's very hard to find financial, tax, and accounting staff who are interested in "knowing" the rules and reasons.  They want the answers.  Quickly.  As easy as possible.  Maybe the biggest change isn't work ethic, so much as a total loss of inquisitive nature.   Why or how doesn't matter...just what.

For now, more senior staff can fill in the holes and avoid the breakage, but that's going to end soon.  When nobody understands why things were done, how will they ever adapt to the constantly changing universe?  

It may all end up OK, because when they can't explain things (like the US tax code), maybe they just start over and by default remove all of the subtle problems that have built up over time, but it's a huge risk.

As negative as I and others can be about AI and its use, it is an amazingly exciting time to be working.   I've lived through the migration from analog to digital in finance, and wish I could stick around long enough to fix some of the legacy issues.   Change can't come fast enough, as I probably only have 10 or 15 years left to play.
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 6:16am

 rgio wrote:

I was just having a discussion with my business partner about this very topic, albeit in a slightly different context.  Content has been the proxy for value in a lot of professions for a long time.  The best content won.  Picture quality. Sound quality.  Research details.  Quality (as you say) was king, and an acceptance of lower quality was done as a concession for other realities, primarily cost.

Now, it's more about the experience.  The ease of consumption, the integration (of everything), the universal availability of what I want, when I want it, wherever I want it.  The vast majority of users will surrender accuracy for the experience.   Thinking less is better than having to work harder, especially when so many don't know the difference between the right and wrong answers.
.
As for language, I'd suggest that it's one of the basic knowledge categories that people look for answers to.  Chair.  It's an object with pretty much a universal definition. Multiple legs, often with a back, used for sitting.  I typed "what is the word for chair in the 10 most popular languages on the planet" into Bard just now...and it returned this..
  1. Mandarin Chinese: 椅子 (yǐzi)
  2. Spanish: silla
  3. English: chair
  4. Hindi: कुर्सी (kūrsē)
  5. Arabic:เก้าอี้ (ghiyā’)
  6. Portuguese: cadeira
  7. Russian:椅子 (yézya)
  8. Japanese: 椅子 (isō)
  9. German: Stuhl
  10. French: chaise
Impressive, but basic.  Sentence structure is more complex, but still relatively simple, as the rules are fixed.  Would you give directions to your hotel using a free app to translate...sure.  Would you buy a house or take a job after translating the contracts using a free tool?  Probably not.  It's a matter of risk/reward, and that kind of complex decisioning will take a very long time to program.  

The human brain is an amazingly complex system, that we still don't quite understand completely.  We can automate some of the basic tasks and heavy lifting, but decision-making for critical issues is a long, long, way off.  At least in my (quite possibly very simple) mind.   Quality has lost ground to speed recently, but the pendulum will swing and people will want assurance of quality for the things they value enough to pay for.


You would be surprised how good some of the machine translations are getting. I also  long thought contextual based translation would be one step too far for a machine, but I was wrong. They are surprisingly good at it. In fact, they are frequently better than human translators. And getting better.

Talking of contracts I recently did a purchase contract for an American selling his apartment here and we decided to run it through DeepL and I'd tweak it a bit to make sure there were no gremlins in there.  Admittedly, I changed a lot, but it wasn't too far off being acceptable for his purposes. 
The biggest problem, as I see it,  is the associated dumbing down of the audience that you refer to. A lot of younger translators are now forced to use machine translations (for cost reasons) but they just don't see the mistakes the machine makes. So over time a wrong translation becomes standard. Likewise a lot of non-native speakers think, yeah, that's just what I wanted to say, but they don't get the cultural nuance or understand what is the right thing to say in a certain situation.  

I recently had one CEO wanting to thank the Chairman of the Supervisory Board (who was stepping down and was basically his boss) for "his cooperation", which is fine in German, as it is neutral, but in English it has a distinct whiff of "thanks for doing everything I told you to do" and IMO inappropriate. He ran it through DeepL and came back at me to say I was wrong.
So, yeah, great, whatever, dude, I thought.  Needless to say, that was one of the clients I lost. This guy is also kind of tone-deaf and the kind of non-native speaker who is convinced he has full mastery of the English language, so I'm not too unhappy to have lost his business. But the ironic thing is the Chairman of the Supervisory Board is also a non-native speaker and wouldn't have had any problem with the phrase, so it turns out the only person not on the same page is me.  In these situations, the machine is going to win.
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 5:43am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:


You are giving me hope rgio!!  But I have doubts about the bolded bit. 
When DVD came out I had a friend who was a sound engineer and invested heavily in a new studio to produce high-end audio quality, believing the market would move to exploit the new sound quality it afforded (mainly for classical music). The opposite happened. The market moved to compressed files and mp3, mainly because everyone could suddenly rip their own files making them basically free.  The same is now happening in my field. Machine translation can come up with some real clangers, but the translations are getting astonishingly better very rapidly. There comes a point when customers' quality expectations begin to fall in favour of something that is maybe not quite so good, but (almost) free.

And if something as complex as language can be handled, with all its nuance. I think it is only a question of time that it starts handling most other fields. All you need is a massive dataset, an ability to recognize patterns, apply logical arguments and mathematical probability models and hey presto, you've got something pretty damn close to the average brain.

I was just having a discussion with my business partner about this very topic, albeit in a slightly different context.  Content has been the proxy for value in a lot of professions for a long time.  The best content won.  Picture quality. Sound quality.  Research details.  Quality (as you say) was king, and an acceptance of lower quality was done as a concession for other realities, primarily cost.

Now, it's more about the experience.  The ease of consumption, the integration (of everything), the universal availability of what I want, when I want it, wherever I want it.  The vast majority of users will surrender accuracy for the experience.   Thinking less is better than having to work harder, especially when so many don't know the difference between the right and wrong answers.
.
As for language, I'd suggest that it's one of the basic knowledge categories that people look for answers to.  Chair.  It's an object with pretty much a universal definition. Multiple legs, often with a back, used for sitting.  I typed "what is the word for chair in the 10 most popular languages on the planet" into Bard just now...and it returned this..
  1. Mandarin Chinese: 椅子 (yǐzi)
  2. Spanish: silla
  3. English: chair
  4. Hindi: कुर्सी (kūrsē)
  5. Arabic:เก้าอี้ (ghiyā’)
  6. Portuguese: cadeira
  7. Russian:椅子 (yézya)
  8. Japanese: 椅子 (isō)
  9. German: Stuhl
  10. French: chaise
Impressive, but basic.  Sentence structure is more complex, but still relatively simple, as the rules are fixed.  Would you give directions to your hotel using a free app to translate...sure.  Would you buy a house or take a job after translating the contracts using a free tool?  Probably not.  It's a matter of risk/reward, and that kind of complex decisioning will take a very long time to program.  

The human brain is an amazingly complex system, that we still don't quite understand completely.  We can automate some of the basic tasks and heavy lifting, but decision-making for critical issues is a long, long, way off.  At least in my (quite possibly very simple) mind.   Quality has lost ground to speed recently, but the pendulum will swing and people will want assurance of quality for the things they value enough to pay for.
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 23, 2023 - 3:33am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

.. and hey presto, you've got something pretty damn close to the average brain.


a case in point.

NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 22, 2023 - 10:37pm

 rgio wrote:

Speed comes in many forms.  The ability to consume is now immense, but machines must be trained by humans for true AI.  The training speed is going to take time.  Google has the internet mapped, and the first few answers I got from Bard were fabricated crap.  

There is also a reality that content and mediation/training are quickly forming teams, and will charge more for focused knowledge.  Chat GPT might do an OK job translating, but I'm sure you have a favorite or two already.  You using those systems will train the datasets you have access to, but they won't improve translation for everyone.  The moats will get wider and the barriers to entry greater.

This year everyone will use as much as they can.  Soon, errors will begin to matter, and people will pull back from the blind acceptance of AI that's going on now.   We have entered the peak of inflated expectations per Gartner's Hype cycle....the trough of disillusionment awaits. 


You are giving me hope rgio!!  But I have doubts about the bolded bit. 
When DVD came out I had a friend who was a sound engineer and invested heavily in a new studio to produce high-end audio quality, believing the market would move to exploit the new sound quality it afforded (mainly for classical music). The opposite happened. The market moved to compressed files and mp3, mainly because everyone could suddenly rip their own files making them basically free.  The same is now happening in my field. Machine translation can come up with some real clangers, but the translations are getting astonishingly better very rapidly. There comes a point when customers' quality expectations begin to fall in favour of something that is maybe not quite so good, but (almost) free.

And if something as complex as language can be handled, with all its nuance. I think it is only a question of time that it starts handling most other fields. All you need is a massive dataset, an ability to recognize patterns, apply logical arguments and mathematical probability models and hey presto, you've got something pretty damn close to the average brain.
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 22, 2023 - 2:46pm

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

I think it is going to go faster than you think. AI has reached a point where its ability to learn is outpacing its  drawbacks.  In my own field (translation) there have been serious inroads by AI tools but we have learned to incorporate them. Last year was my busiest ever. This year is also busy (so far).. but prices have plummeted. I can't afford to keep my employee on anymore, which means loss of quality and ultimately less competitiveness on  a market dominated by increasingly powerful AI machines. I have lost one major client so far (well, two actually, but won three others) but still..  It's only a matter of time.  Time to think about becoming a professional athlete I guess. 

Speed comes in many forms.  The ability to consume is now immense, but machines must be trained by humans for true AI.  The training speed is going to take time.  Google has the internet mapped, and the first few answers I got from Bard were fabricated crap.  

There is also a reality that content and mediation/training are quickly forming teams, and will charge more for focused knowledge.  Chat GPT might do an OK job translating, but I'm sure you have a favorite or two already.  You using those systems will train the datasets you have access to, but they won't improve translation for everyone.  The moats will get wider and the barriers to entry greater.

This year everyone will use as much as they can.  Soon, errors will begin to matter, and people will pull back from the blind acceptance of AI that's going on now.   We have entered the peak of inflated expectations per Gartner's Hype cycle....the trough of disillusionment awaits. 

R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Mar 22, 2023 - 2:21pm

A greed bias
Medicare Advantage Uses Algorithms to Block Care for Seniors
Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 22, 2023 - 1:47pm

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:


ok, scratch artists. 

what's left?    clergy, diplomats, plumbers..  might go for plumber.

I have a few friends who are plumbers - one can make a good living at it once you get established, but among the building trades, fewer people seem to want that one - especially when starting out.  Yeah, I can't see AI being able to do much of what it involves - at least unless/until the methods and materials of construction change drastically.
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 22, 2023 - 1:39pm

 rgio wrote:

It's going to be a long time before AI replaces almost all jobs.  What will happen quickly is that it will separate occupations into "those using AI" and those not.  A lawyer who effectively uses it will be much more productive than one who doesn't.  Accountants, coders, and dozens of others. 

#20 on the list is Small business owners.  While it may not eliminate the need for people to run small companies, it very well may be a requirement to successfully market, manage, and grow a company.  At some point, not using AI as a small business owner is going to put your company at a competitive disadvantage.

FWIW - I've been using both GPT4 and Bard, and they both have some serious problems.


I think it is going to go faster than you think. AI has reached a point where its ability to learn is outpacing its  drawbacks.  In my own field (translation) there have been serious inroads by AI tools but we have learned to incorporate them. Last year was my busiest ever. This year is also busy (so far).. but prices have plummeted. I can't afford to keep my employee on anymore, which means loss of quality and ultimately less competitiveness on  a market dominated by increasingly powerful AI machines. I have lost one major client so far (well, two actually, but won three others) but still..  It's only a matter of time.  Time to think about becoming a professional athlete I guess. 


Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next